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 Post subject: W. Moore Shotgun
PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2011 6:47 pm 
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W. Moore & Co. shotgun. Wondering if its worth much and what gauge shells it uses. I did a little internet research and it looks like this is a model that was manufactured in England.
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Last edited by Ken81 on Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: W. Moore Shotgun
PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2011 11:49 pm 
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First we need to determine which William Moore & Company gun we are talking about. There are two and maybe three makers that used that name, two English and one Belgian. They are William Moore & Co and English maker from 1854 to 1872 and William & Grey Moore another English maker from 1873 to 1931 and the name was used by Henri Pieper on Belgian made "Trade Brand Name" shotguns. The name ,William Moore & Co was also used by Crescent Fire Arms Company of Norwich,CT on guns they made for and sold by H & D Folsom of New York City. To make the determination, look at the bottom of the barrels under the forearm. English made guns will have crossed scepters or halberds (spear battle axe) with a crown over that and letters in the intersections. Belgian made guns will have the letters "ELG" in an oval with a crown over that while an American made gun will not have any proof marks. I can't see any proof marks in the photographs.


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 Post subject: Re: W. Moore Shotgun
PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2011 5:35 am 
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Markings - Top between the barrels 'W. Moore & Co. London Damascus Steel' The bottom of the barrels has a number of markings including proof marks of crossed battle axes with a crown ontop and the leters B,P,C at the intersections. The poof mark is of of British origin from 1868-1925, Proof House: Birmingham, Type of proof and gun: definitive black powder proof for shotguns. There is also a patent no:3718 1877 on the water table. Thanks for the help.


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 Post subject: Re: W. Moore Shotgun
PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2011 6:29 am 
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Your patent 3718 was held by C G Bonehill of Birmingham and refers to the 'clip lump', this was a method of fabricating barrel lumps & top rib in one as used in Bonehill's "Interchangeable" gun.
As Ned Fall has pointed out Wm Moore became Wm Moore & Grey in 1872 ( its the same William Moore) so how a gun obviously dating from 1877 onward bears the Wm Moore name is a bit of a mystery. I would guess that this gun was actually manufactured by Bonehill and shows the Wm Moore & Co name for export purposes. It was quite common for makers such as Bonehill to produce guns which were then marked with another trade name. This guess is reinforced by the Birmingham Proof stamps as opposed to London Proof which would be expected on a Wm Moore (of London) gun.Of course a gun bearing the name of a London maker would sell for a bit more than a similiar gun from Birmingham and the English/British gun trade looked for any way to increase profits ( they still do).
Unless the gun has been altered the chambers will be 2 1/2" and that with Black Powder proof will knock the value down severely. I have no idea on USA values. The gun would have to be checked by someone competent to measure the proof status - it is marked 13 bore which equates to something between .710" and .719" at proof, if it is now greater than .719" it is out of proof and imo a wallhanger. If it is still in proof and otherwise sound the value would go up a bit but you would need to find a Black Powder shooter to buy it.


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 Post subject: Re: W. Moore Shotgun
PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 6:50 pm 
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So any idea how much the gun is worth in the US?


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 Post subject: Re: W. Moore Shotgun
PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 7:38 pm 
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It would have little value to much of the US, but much greater value to hammergun lovers - the best marketplace for it (a Vintager's ShotgunFest, for example ), as long as the buttstock is unmolested.

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 Post subject: Re: W. Moore Shotgun
PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2011 7:19 pm 
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Old Double barrel hammer shotgun values in the U.S. are determined by the condition of the gun, the amount of original finish remaining on the metal and wood as well as the mechanical condition. Also the construction of the gun (i.e/ damascus barrels) are a factor. A prime condition example that appears to have come out of the factory yesterday afternoon might bring as much as $125.00 U.S.
A rusty rotten broken incomplete piece of junk fit only for parts salvage or as a fire place poker might bring as little as $10.00. Most I have seen sold on the various auction sites have sold for between $50.00 and $100.00 and they were sold as either wall hanger decorators or to nuts like me who are collectors.


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 Post subject: Re: W. Moore Shotgun
PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:51 pm 
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Thank you everyone for the input. You are all a very knowledgeable bunch. The gun's buttstock is all original and the blue finish on the barrels is in very good shape. I learned that this used to belong to a commercial duck hunter on Long Island back in the day. Thanks again. BTW - Is this a 12 gauge or 10 gauge ?

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 Post subject: Re: W. Moore Shotgun
PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 4:22 pm 
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Its a 12 gauge.
I think maybe the barrels are damascus and have been blued.

Even with Black Powder proof a gun like this (in proof) would make $500 or maybe a little more at auction here in the UK - usually prices are the other way around (i.e. higher in the USA) but times and fashions change :)


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 Post subject: Re: W. Moore Shotgun
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:05 pm 
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Went by the local gun smith and showed him the gun. Says the barrels look good and that it could handle 65 mm/2 1/2 inch low compression shells. I'm going to order a box and test it out at the range.


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 Post subject: Re: W. Moore Shotgun
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:16 pm 
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If your gunsmith did not measure the chamber length and wall thickness, please see http://www.lcsmith.org/faq/safetoshoot.html and seek a second opinion.
If the barrels have been hot blued, the ribs will separate from the barrels with shooting.

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